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you are quoting a heck of a lot there.
[QUOTE]blah blah blah[/QUOTE] to reply to Murph.
Please remove excess text as not to re-post tons
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[QUOTE="Murph:604275"]ArrowHead NLI said:[QUOTE]Murph said:[QUOTE]Well, I was not going to say anything, but when "faux intellectual" comes into the conversation, then it becomes insulting. Your idea that having a "drastic, irrational, and intolerant" reaction to Christianity actually created all the reasons why I'm so anti-Christian is such an overused cliche and downright ridiculous. (So people are murdered because they are anti-murder?) In fact, it doesn't even make sense. Read my reasons above for why I feel the way I do, and not one points to me, or any other free-thinking individual past or present, having done anything to deserve death or blacklisting other than feeling differently and/or setting those feelings in print. Also, my issue is not just with Roman Catholicism, but with the many offshoots from early Christian tradition that demolished many cultures and beliefs (Arianism, Literalist Christianity, the writings of Justin Martyr and Clement of Alexander to name a few). Roman Catholicism did not fully register itself until the third-fourth century AD, by which time many "godman" traditions were in jeopardy due to politcal and religious furor. (Goodbye to many amazing texts) And I don't make my argument against Christianity for anyone else to jump ship and join me. I understand fully how radical my feelings are, and maybe somewhat jaded, but it's just how I feel. Your thought that "my current beliefs" have me spinning in circles is another cliche amongst cliches in that rant. Seriously, you write as if what you say is sound and concrete, but is actually rather weak and unsubstantiated. You're not smarter than everyone else, so stop trying to climb into my head and tell me why think the way I do. "Attacking without provocation" has worked well for many religions, I think its time someone else attacks, except this time with purpose.[/QUOTE] I actually had some well thought out points to make to this. Seeing you still trying to justify jumping down this kid's throat without provocation made me want to jump right back in and defend the underdog some more. However, I see that Conqueror has decided he will in fact bring his beliefs into this argument, so at this point I leave him to defend himself. As for your own points, murph, they're weak. Especially the part where you refer to my statements as "cliche". I'd love to see you link any single fucking proof of redundancy in what I've said. Disagree if you like, but your accusation there would be naught but a bullshit cop-out. And again, there is no difference at all between one type of intolerance and another. You're showing intolerance to Christianity at it's merest mention. How you feel that is any way different than the churches past atrocities baffles me. And AGAIN, you've shown that EVERY problem you have is with varying CHURCHES of christ. I still have yet to see you make one useful point against christ himself. Personally, as I've said, I've had no use for the almighty teriyaki man. However, I would never deprive CTB of his right to worship him, nor would I try to dissuade him from believing something that helps him find peace. If he were to do something bad in the name of christ, then I would say or do something. But then, you'll notice that YOU act like an asshole, and I ALSO say or do something. That's the point, and ironically it's one of the founding principles of Satanism. I don't care WHAT you believe, and mopst likely neither does CTB. For you to rip in and blast him like that was something he didn't ask for or deserve, so I stood up for him. And to quell your ridiculous fear of Christianity, if he were to attack your own beliefs in such a way, I would have stood up for you as well. I don't care what your faith is. I only care what it makes you do. [/QUOTE] Well, there was really no redundancy in what you said, by you. HOWEVER, your point that intolerance spurns the ills of both sides to an argument is fucking CLICHE. There are varying degrees of intolerance, as there varying degrees of everything. Our legal system dictates that the form of punishment does not always directly mirror the severity of the crime. That's why not all murderers are killed, rapists raped/castrated, etc. I would not lay a finger on anyone because of their beliefs, and would never do anything besides argue. It's a sensitive topic, but for me, it's worth the discussion: no more. The position that simple emotion or states of mental being correlate and equate is childish; if that view was seriously held by more people, there would be no cause for uprising, challenging the system, creating freedom for oppression because then the "defactors" would be charged with the same crimes as their oppressors? NOPE. Also, you said earlier that my problem was with the Roman Catholic church, and now "agree" with something you believe you said earlier (you did not) that I have issues with varying Christian churches. Pick a side of your own argument and stick with it. Not once did I make an argument that made my opinion anywhere near the "faults" I perceive in Christianity. I do not destroy Christian texts, nor do I try in any way to prevent them from worship, nor do I suppress any information whatsoever. I did not address intolerance and adherence as my motivating factor, merely that the damage was done. At that time, it was mostly political anyway, but these things still happened and continue to happen today (non-profit Christian groups endorsing particular candidates, tax-breaks way overboard from our government, the attacks on homosexuality and pregnancy). Your parallel about intolerance in jihadists and radicals and mine is a societal cliche, my friend. My "intolerance and ignorance" is miles away from that behavior, and I'm sick of people who believe that fervor = terrorism. They are not of the same condition, there are millions of ways one can choose to express their beliefs. Putting my opinion on par with the same that drives those factions is ridiculous. I could write for years about my issues with the historical Christ, and the subsequent dissemination of his life and message. No one hear wants to read that: if they do, I'll write a paper and send her out. I never said anything about CTB not being able to worship anything his hearts desires, and actually (though I don't know him) think he's a nice kid who posts some great stuff on here and gets treated with much hostility. I would only give him ribbing for his Christian status, but to me, everyone is a human and deserves every right that I do. For you to call me an "asshole" for voicing my opinion and giving evidence and at least an point-of-view for each of my reasonings, goes against your view that "everyone should be able to feel or worship how they please." If you only care what people's views or beliefs make them do, and think I'm an asshole, then realize the only thing I do is speak occasionally and write my meanderings once in a great while on this messageboard. If that puts me in your scope, whether as a Satanist or not, does not bother me. It's a messageboard, and while it may seem geeky or unnecessary, sometimes these discussions arise, just as they do in human interaction. I have no problem with you calling my points weak, but at every available moment I have given a source or direct link to my motivation. [/QUOTE]
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